WEBVTT 00:03.877 --> 00:05.110 JULIE HYMAN: As we mentioned earlier, 00:05.110 --> 00:08.109 the JP Morgan Health Care Conference does kick off today, 00:08.109 --> 00:10.150 a lot of CEOs speaking there, a lot 00:10.150 --> 00:11.470 of deals and collaborations being 00:11.470 --> 00:13.720 announced in advance of that. 00:13.720 --> 00:15.580 Our Anjalee Khemlani is here with us 00:15.580 --> 00:17.710 and with a special guest, Albert Bourla, 00:17.710 --> 00:19.660 who is the CEO of Pfizer. 00:19.660 --> 00:21.790 Anjalee, take it away. 00:21.790 --> 00:24.060 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Thank you, Julie, and hello to Albert. 00:24.060 --> 00:25.780 Thank you again for joining us today. 00:25.780 --> 00:27.090 I know that you and I were both looking 00:27.090 --> 00:30.240 forward to possibly seeing each other in person this time. 00:30.240 --> 00:33.810 But, unfortunately, Omicron got in the way. 00:33.810 --> 00:37.080 I want to start off with talking about that, actually, and just 00:37.080 --> 00:38.820 the impact that you're seeing. 00:38.820 --> 00:42.570 We know that here in the US that, you know, 00:42.570 --> 00:45.430 we've had discussions about boosters coming this fall. 00:45.430 --> 00:47.430 And we're watching the Omicron wave 00:47.430 --> 00:50.580 really surge in certain parts of the country as 00:50.580 --> 00:51.780 well as the world. 00:51.780 --> 00:54.540 Tell me what you're seeing in terms of the potential 00:54.540 --> 00:58.170 for possibly changing how we look at boosters 00:58.170 --> 01:00.330 and what kinds of boosters you anticipate. 01:00.330 --> 01:03.040 I know you're working on an Omicron-specific booster 01:03.040 --> 01:03.840 as well right now. 01:03.840 --> 01:08.420 So what's at stake for us in fall of '22? 01:08.420 --> 01:09.980 ALBERT BOURLA: Here the situation 01:09.980 --> 01:12.710 has been deteriorated because of the Omicron, 01:12.710 --> 01:15.710 which had a very quick ramp-up. 01:15.710 --> 01:20.360 It is a disease that manifests a little bit less 01:20.360 --> 01:22.910 in terms of mildness. 01:22.910 --> 01:23.900 I mean, it's more mild. 01:23.900 --> 01:29.300 But, you know, because of the higher infectious rates, still, 01:29.300 --> 01:30.800 the hospitals, in absolute numbers, 01:30.800 --> 01:33.620 are going much higher in terms of severe disease, 01:33.620 --> 01:35.750 ICUs' occupation, et cetera, et cetera. 01:35.750 --> 01:40.190 So-- and we know that the two doses of the vaccine 01:40.190 --> 01:42.590 offer very limited protection, if any. 01:42.590 --> 01:45.170 The three doses, with the booster, 01:45.170 --> 01:48.620 they offer reasonable protection against hospitalization 01:48.620 --> 01:50.848 and deaths-- 01:50.848 --> 01:53.780 and, again, that's, I think, very good-- 01:53.780 --> 01:57.980 and less protection against the infection. 01:57.980 --> 02:02.300 Now, we are working on a new version of our vaccine-- 02:02.300 --> 02:04.790 the 1.1, let me put it that way-- 02:04.790 --> 02:07.440 that will cover Omicron as well. 02:07.440 --> 02:13.400 And, of course, we are waiting to have the final results. 02:13.400 --> 02:15.890 The vaccine will be ready in March. 02:15.890 --> 02:19.670 And the vaccine, we'll be able to produce it massively. 02:19.670 --> 02:22.610 We need to see if we will need it. 02:22.610 --> 02:24.500 And we need to see if-- 02:24.500 --> 02:29.270 and what place it can take in the overall fight 02:29.270 --> 02:32.000 against the virus, particularly now that we 02:32.000 --> 02:34.340 know that mutations are coming faster, 02:34.340 --> 02:36.300 but we have a treatment. 02:36.300 --> 02:37.835 So all of that needs to be taken seriously 02:37.835 --> 02:40.310 [? in this direction. ?] But we've never had more 02:40.310 --> 02:45.690 weapons on our [? box tool. ?] 02:45.690 --> 02:47.590 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Absolutely, and Pfizer, of course, 02:47.590 --> 02:48.480 taking the lead with that. 02:48.480 --> 02:51.040 I know that you've expanded of course, 02:51.040 --> 02:53.380 your collaborations on that front, 02:53.380 --> 02:56.130 especially with BioNTech for mRNA. 02:56.130 --> 02:59.250 But I want to quickly talk about the kids' vaccine 02:59.250 --> 03:00.460 before we get to that. 03:00.460 --> 03:03.810 I know that right now, there's a lot of parents waiting for that 03:03.810 --> 03:05.250 under five to come out. 03:05.250 --> 03:08.400 And the company has said that it's going to need 03:08.400 --> 03:10.120 to be a three-dose vaccine. 03:10.120 --> 03:11.970 Do you see that to be the case for adults 03:11.970 --> 03:15.000 as well, especially as we see that, while you do offer really 03:15.000 --> 03:18.360 strong protection, the waning immunity is an issue 03:18.360 --> 03:21.720 because it wanes pretty quickly? 03:21.720 --> 03:22.660 ALBERT BOURLA: Yes. 03:22.660 --> 03:24.070 First of all, I don't have any doubts 03:24.070 --> 03:26.700 that this is also, for adults, a three-dose vaccine. 03:26.700 --> 03:30.190 And I think this is what basically everyone-- 03:30.190 --> 03:31.600 every health authority in the world-- 03:31.600 --> 03:33.100 is recommending right now. 03:33.100 --> 03:35.590 Now, the question is if we will need, let's say, 03:35.590 --> 03:37.330 annual boosters or not. 03:37.330 --> 03:39.610 But this is a three-doses of vaccine, 03:39.610 --> 03:43.180 particularly for the adults. 03:43.180 --> 03:44.947 What was the second question that you asked, Anjalee? 03:44.947 --> 03:46.213 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Sorry, for the kids, 03:46.213 --> 03:47.560 the update on the timeline there, 03:47.560 --> 03:49.450 knowing that there are so many parents 03:49.450 --> 03:50.440 waiting for that under five. 03:50.440 --> 03:53.790 Do you have an updated timeline on when we can see that? 03:53.790 --> 03:55.750 ALBERT BOURLA: I think that things will move fast. 03:55.750 --> 04:01.370 We are collecting, right now, data from the third dose. 04:01.370 --> 04:03.730 We are having, already, data from the second dose 04:03.730 --> 04:07.720 because two doses in younger kids 04:07.720 --> 04:09.790 is different than in adults. 04:09.790 --> 04:13.510 We are in discussions with FDA, and they will submit them-- 04:13.510 --> 04:15.650 everything to them. 04:15.650 --> 04:21.790 I hope that things can move very, very fast, actually, 04:21.790 --> 04:24.683 not in months, in a few weeks. 04:24.683 --> 04:25.650 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Sure, yeah. 04:25.650 --> 04:27.750 We're all waiting for that, for sure. 04:27.750 --> 04:29.340 And when you were talking about-- 04:29.340 --> 04:31.210 the treatments are also out there, 04:31.210 --> 04:36.000 but we also still need to meet global needs for vaccines. 04:36.000 --> 04:39.630 I know you've repeatedly said that you have 04:39.630 --> 04:41.640 had refusals for the vaccines. 04:41.640 --> 04:44.620 There's also vaccine hesitancy as an issue, 04:44.620 --> 04:47.220 especially in lower- and middle-income countries. 04:47.220 --> 04:49.140 Is that still the situation now? 04:49.140 --> 04:52.710 Have you found a change after you started shipping more 04:52.710 --> 04:55.400 towards the end of last year? 04:55.400 --> 04:56.200 ALBERT BOURLA: Oh, yes. 04:56.200 --> 04:58.660 First of all, let's put some statistic out there. 04:58.660 --> 05:02.210 In 2021, we had said that we would produce over 3 05:02.210 --> 05:04.000 billion doses, and we did. 05:04.000 --> 05:09.250 We released 3 billion doses, from which 2.6 billion, 05:09.250 --> 05:11.800 approximately, were shipped to countries. 05:11.800 --> 05:14.890 Among those 2.6, a billion were shipped 05:14.890 --> 05:17.770 to middle- and low-income countries, so 38%. 05:17.770 --> 05:20.110 So that's what we had promised, and this 05:20.110 --> 05:21.340 is what we have delivered. 05:21.340 --> 05:24.580 Now, what is the situation, particularly for the lower 05:24.580 --> 05:27.220 income of this range? 05:27.220 --> 05:31.150 Right now, we have more than they can absorb, unfortunately. 05:31.150 --> 05:35.680 And I think all the efforts of the WHO, 05:35.680 --> 05:39.730 of UNICEF, of philanthropic organizations like Gates, 05:39.730 --> 05:42.490 Doctors Without [? Medicines, ?] and us 05:42.490 --> 05:46.210 should be in one fighting the misinformation 05:46.210 --> 05:52.660 in these countries and creating a vaccine advocacy 05:52.660 --> 05:55.150 and support because people are hesitant to do 05:55.150 --> 05:58.510 it in higher numbers than in the high-income countries. 05:58.510 --> 06:01.570 But, also, there is a lack of infrastructure. 06:01.570 --> 06:03.760 Sometimes, it's difficult even to carry the vaccine 06:03.760 --> 06:05.470 to a vaccination center. 06:05.470 --> 06:08.710 We use-- we worked with a project 06:08.710 --> 06:10.420 to carry them with drones. 06:10.420 --> 06:11.990 It was very successful. 06:11.990 --> 06:16.040 The drones could carry, in these low temperatures, the vaccines. 06:16.040 --> 06:18.580 But we didn't have where to take them, eventually, because they 06:18.580 --> 06:21.690 are not operating vaccination centers in the rural parts 06:21.690 --> 06:22.490 of the country. 06:22.490 --> 06:25.090 So all of these are issues that needs to be addressed. 06:25.090 --> 06:27.953 And that should be the focus of everyone right now. 06:27.953 --> 06:28.920 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Definitely. 06:28.920 --> 06:29.040 ALBERT BOURLA: [? The ?] [? supply's ?] [? not ?] 06:29.040 --> 06:29.840 [INAUDIBLE]. 06:29.840 --> 06:31.340 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: And, to that point-- 06:31.340 --> 06:32.150 absolutely. 06:32.150 --> 06:34.250 And, to that point, the mRNA really being a newer 06:34.250 --> 06:36.230 technology, for these countries to absorb that 06:36.230 --> 06:37.670 has been part of the issue. 06:37.670 --> 06:40.940 I know that you created that agreement with South 06:40.940 --> 06:42.800 Africa, the Biovac Institute. 06:42.800 --> 06:45.620 And, with the sort of investment that you're 06:45.620 --> 06:48.830 making in mRNA right now, expanding that agreement 06:48.830 --> 06:52.370 with BioNTech, that partnership, and moving into other vaccines, 06:52.370 --> 06:55.220 do you see this as more of a long-term plan? 06:55.220 --> 06:58.310 And do you see maybe resolving some of those transportation 06:58.310 --> 07:02.550 and logistical issues as part of your work there? 07:02.550 --> 07:03.350 ALBERT BOURLA: Yes. 07:03.350 --> 07:08.030 I think the transportation and logistical issues has-- 07:08.030 --> 07:10.860 that are related to the nature of our vaccine, 07:10.860 --> 07:13.430 [INAUDIBLE] have been addressed. 07:13.430 --> 07:17.960 Right now, we are able to produce a new formulation that 07:17.960 --> 07:22.430 can stay two and 1/2 months in normal refrigeration, 07:22.430 --> 07:24.570 so like every other vaccine. 07:24.570 --> 07:26.250 So I don't think this is the issue. 07:26.250 --> 07:30.410 The issue, it is that there are not people to inject. 07:30.410 --> 07:31.753 There's no health care practitioners. 07:31.753 --> 07:33.020 There is not a [? sender ?] to receive 07:33.020 --> 07:34.520 it so that people can come. 07:34.520 --> 07:37.520 And, very importantly, people are not 07:37.520 --> 07:39.860 queuing outside to get the vaccine, because they 07:39.860 --> 07:41.580 don't believe in that. 07:41.580 --> 07:44.510 So these are the issues, mainly, that needs to be addressed. 07:44.510 --> 07:47.580 As regards to the investment we are doing in the area, 07:47.580 --> 07:49.640 it's not only on the COVID vaccine. 07:49.640 --> 07:51.590 But, clearly, we are investing a lot 07:51.590 --> 07:54.200 to make sure that we make better vaccines, the Omicron 07:54.200 --> 07:57.200 one, a vaccine that can cover Omicron in addition 07:57.200 --> 07:59.510 to everything else is, for example, a good example. 07:59.510 --> 08:02.130 But we are also working-- 08:02.130 --> 08:07.380 we just announced three new deals today. 08:07.380 --> 08:09.230 One is with [? Beam ?] [? Therapeutics ?] 08:09.230 --> 08:13.940 that is trying to harness the power of mRNA in gene editing. 08:13.940 --> 08:19.190 The other is with Codex, which will potentially allow us 08:19.190 --> 08:26.570 to reduce the time in manufacturing of RNA from one 08:26.570 --> 08:28.550 month, which is the [? part ?] [? it ?] takes now to make 08:28.550 --> 08:30.290 the DNA, to maybe a few days-- 08:30.290 --> 08:31.520 very, very important. 08:31.520 --> 08:34.039 And the other is licenses from Acuitas's 08:34.039 --> 08:36.320 LMP, 10 targets of LMP. 08:36.320 --> 08:39.980 LMP is the technology that uses lipid nanoparticles 08:39.980 --> 08:42.770 to transfer RNA to our tissues. 08:42.770 --> 08:48.260 So we truly believe that the mRNA 08:48.260 --> 08:50.000 technology is very powerful. 08:50.000 --> 08:52.560 It's not the holy grail, but it is very powerful. 08:52.560 --> 08:54.590 We are just scratching the surface. 08:54.590 --> 08:58.520 And we are very, very well positioned to put together 08:58.520 --> 09:00.320 capabilities of others and ourselves 09:00.320 --> 09:03.523 to produce medicines that the world needs. 09:03.523 --> 09:04.490 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Absolutely. 09:04.490 --> 09:06.210 And, speaking of medicines that the world needs, 09:06.210 --> 09:09.440 we also see the antiviral, you know, making its way 09:09.440 --> 09:12.710 throughout the world, production of that still ramping 09:12.710 --> 09:14.700 up and deliveries as well. 09:14.700 --> 09:17.540 So, while supplies are constrained for right now, 09:17.540 --> 09:22.130 do you see that impacting, really, the pandemic in sort 09:22.130 --> 09:25.010 of the way that people have been anticipating, 09:25.010 --> 09:26.570 especially because it's coming a little bit 09:26.570 --> 09:30.280 after this Omicron spread? 09:30.280 --> 09:32.120 ALBERT BOURLA: I think it's coming-- 09:32.120 --> 09:34.390 I wish we had it in larger quantities, 09:34.390 --> 09:37.600 but it came exactly the moment that you needed. 09:37.600 --> 09:39.710 I think it's a game changer. 09:39.710 --> 09:43.840 It is a game changer because we know that the people 09:43.840 --> 09:46.960 are getting way more sick-- 09:46.960 --> 09:49.150 first of all, they are unvaccinated people that they 09:49.150 --> 09:50.690 are getting hospitalizations. 09:50.690 --> 09:54.250 They are people that new variants don't protect. 09:54.250 --> 09:58.580 And, clearly, Omicron is not going to be the only variant 09:58.580 --> 09:59.380 that exists there. 09:59.380 --> 10:02.230 And this wave is not going to be the only wave that we 10:02.230 --> 10:04.160 are facing, unfortunately. 10:04.160 --> 10:05.950 But this is the reality. 10:05.950 --> 10:10.090 The virus is endemic almost all over the world. 10:10.090 --> 10:14.260 And, also, both the natural infection 10:14.260 --> 10:18.260 and vaccinations, they don't produce lasting immunity 10:18.260 --> 10:19.060 against this virus. 10:19.060 --> 10:21.730 It's not that the vaccines that they have-- 10:21.730 --> 10:24.280 it is the virus that has these characteristics. 10:24.280 --> 10:26.800 As I said, even the natural infection 10:26.800 --> 10:34.300 produces even smaller, less durable immune responses. 10:34.300 --> 10:37.150 And so the virus will be here for many, many years. 10:37.150 --> 10:41.950 And we are lucky that we have pills and vaccines 10:41.950 --> 10:45.070 of high, high, high effectiveness 10:45.070 --> 10:48.370 so that we can control it and go back to normal lives, 10:48.370 --> 10:50.280 which is the given right now-- 10:50.280 --> 10:51.480 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Right, absolutely. 10:51.480 --> 10:51.660 ALBERT BOURLA: --which is [INAUDIBLE]---- 10:51.660 --> 10:52.650 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: We're all looking forward to that. 10:52.650 --> 10:53.550 ALBERT BOURLA: --right now. 10:53.550 --> 10:54.780 This is what everybody is asking. 10:54.780 --> 10:57.447 Go back to normal life. 10:57.447 --> 10:58.380 ANJALEE KHEMLANI: Certainly. 10:58.380 --> 10:59.970 And it certainly has set the stage 10:59.970 --> 11:03.090 for you to be able to expand, like you mentioned, in mRNA. 11:03.090 --> 11:06.910 So I believe that we're gonna be hearing a lot more about this. 11:06.910 --> 11:08.850 Unfortunately, we have to leave it there. 11:08.850 --> 11:11.760 But Albert Bourla, CEO of Pfizer, 11:11.760 --> 11:13.440 thank you so much again for your time 11:13.440 --> 11:16.020 and helping us with our coverage for JPM this year. 11:16.020 --> 11:20.700 All the best, and look forward to speaking to you again soon. 11:20.700 --> 11:22.653 Julie, back to you. 11:22.653 --> 11:23.620 JULIE HYMAN: Thanks, Anjalee. 11:23.620 --> 11:26.080 Appreciate it, and yes, indeed, back to normal 11:26.080 --> 11:29.460 is what we are all hoping for.